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£450 very tidy Space Harrier Deluxe in Glasgow

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ben76 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ben76 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2018 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

A bit silly, reading the thread about the board thief wanting his details removed. His board username is the same as his car business (and is on his youtube videos)

Anyway, it would be great to do some group development, so I'm downloading circuit maker to have a play. I'll put some bits on the schematic to get it started.
I think a lot of the board may be the turn-on control for the triacs to vary the speed - it seems to feed in the AC to sync with it (and set the turn-on angle). So not too worried about the PAL - either we find a dump, or we do our own at a later date via deduction and scoping (I think it's just a counter/compare for the phase duration of the triac to let the CPU vary the speed.)

What's better though?
1. Replicate the circuit as closely as possible, using modern equivalents (that are readily available)

2. Stick most of the circuit in a PIC chip and maybe change the power circuit?

Rather favouring option 1.
I'll be honest... Space harrier is sh*t... OK now onto the answer... ?? If you're planning on delving in then I'd say which is easier for you... As if the board is the fabled ark then if it gets returned then brilliant, etc however I'd say as its so rare anything that may help keep machines running is a bonus. I'll honestly admit to having no clue but if the same stuff is used in say outrun dlx which would make the easiest pcb to be programmed for use in both?

- Ben
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2018 at 10:19pm
I don't even own either (and probably never will). Just looks like a bit of fun to do (if others can share the boring bits like dragging tracks around).
It would definitely have to support all games.
Going with option 1 for now. Will see how I get on and put details up once I've got some components down.

http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2018 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

I don't even own either (and probably never will). Just looks like a bit of fun to do (if others can share the boring bits like dragging tracks around).
It would definitely have to support all games.
Going with option 1 for now. Will see how I get on and put details up once I've got some components down.


I can help with that. I'm already designing an IO board for Model X series with JVS and USB support... Confused
Though I predominantly use eagle:


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iamjimmi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2018 at 10:07pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:


Is there any clearer schematics than the Space Harrier docs?
http://pdf.textfiles.com/manuals/ARCADE/S-Z/Space%20Harrier%20%5BSchematics%5D%20%5BEnglish%5D.pdf


Stumbled across some jpgs on KLOV.

I have uploaded here:

SH Schematics
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2018 at 10:21pm
Excellent - they are certainly a bit clearer!

I'm working on the schematics right now.

Circuit Maker is basically a free version of a £20K program, so I'm rather liking it (I like Altium ).

I'll play for a day or two more, then I'll work out how to make the project public (it's on the cloud now, but I think it's hidden).

I could definitely do with more help as all the 74LS logic hasn't been put on the cloud yet, so I'm having to create lots of schematic symbols.

I'll put up a new thread when I get the project public.



Edited by John Bennett - 16 May 2018 at 10:39pm
http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote iamjimmi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2018 at 10:23pm
I have managed to contact Andreas (caracho) and asked him to send some pics that he had taken of his motor board - apparently there is an obvious repair which should help identify if I have the infamous board.

Andreas has a couple of none working motor boards and a working OutRun motor board. Not sure why he hasn't these shipped to RetroClinic to sort out (I have asked)?? He has been in contact with Mark to share a dump of the 82s153 (from his working Outrun).

Andreas kindly offered to share that dump with us - so I will ask him to send.


Edited by iamjimmi - 16 May 2018 at 10:26pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2018 at 10:27pm
Nice. Is it one dump for both PALs as one of them has slightly more functionality than the other? (I guess the pins just aren't wired through for IC6).

http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote karlcdoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2018 at 11:08pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

Nice. Is it one dump for both PALs as one of them has slightly more functionality than the other? (I guess the pins just aren't wired through for IC6).



On space harrier the part numbers on the sega sticky labels (on mine at least) are slightly different, can't remember the part number  I'll have to go and read it off but one is postfixed with an 'A' so whether its totally different or just an alternate revision we shall see. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 9:29am
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

Excellent - they are certainly a bit clearer!

I'm working on the schematics right now.

Circuit Maker is basically a free version of a £20K program, so I'm rather liking it (I like Altium ).

I'll play for a day or two more, then I'll work out how to make the project public (it's on the cloud now, but I think it's hidden).

I could definitely do with more help as all the 74LS logic hasn't been put on the cloud yet, so I'm having to create lots of schematic symbols.

I'll put up a new thread when I get the project public.



I have all the 74 series on my software, dont know if you can convert from eagle to CM? Failing that, send a drawn schem and i can do the board side of it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Phil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 9:34am
Just latched onto this thread as I've been on holiday! It's always awesome seeing the community come together.

If there anything I can do, let me know. Not that I can do much!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alpha1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 9:42am
Originally posted by Big Phil Big Phil wrote:

Just latched onto this thread as I've been on holiday! It's always awesome seeing the community come together.

If there anything I can do, let me know. Not that I can do much!

Yeah I concur - turning out awesome!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 9:54am

Originally posted by NaokiS NaokiS wrote:


I have all the 74 series on my software, dont know if you can convert from eagle to CM? Failing that, send a drawn schem and i can do the board side of it


It's OK - I did them all - didn't take long . Most were there, just in SMT format (cut and paste and change footprint ). Pretty much every component is there, or something similar that can be tweaked.
The idea is you pick a part from the live 'octopart' database and if it hasn't got a symbol and a footprint, you create one, then stick it back into the database for everyone.

I'll get a move on tonight and make a new thread and put some links up.

I don't think the schematics will take that long, just nice to have others to glance at them for review.
The PCB routing is the team effort
I figured we could use an image of the original as a bitmap to place the components in very similar places, then we can choose to route it as similarly as we can be bothered to.
http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 9:59am
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:


Originally posted by NaokiS NaokiS wrote:


I have all the 74 series on my software, dont know if you can convert from eagle to CM? Failing that, send a drawn schem and i can do the board side of it


It's OK - I did them all - didn't take long . Most were there, just in SMT format (cut and paste and change footprint ). Pretty much every component is there, or something similar that can be tweaked.
The idea is you pick a part from the live 'octopart' database and if it hasn't got a symbol and a footprint, you create one, then stick it back into the database for everyone.

I'll get a move on tonight and make a new thread and put some links up.

I don't think the schematics will take that long, just nice to have others to glance at them for review.
The PCB routing is the team effort
I figured we could use an image of the original as a bitmap to place the components in very similar places, then we can choose to route it as similarly as we can be bothered to.


The routing seems like a night or so work for me, doesn't look to bad. Could probably knock it out over the weekend if i had schems
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 10:10am
Originally posted by karlcdoe karlcdoe wrote:

Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

Nice. Is it one dump for both PALs as one of them has slightly more functionality than the other? (I guess the pins just aren't wired through for IC6).



On space harrier the part numbers on the sega sticky labels (on mine at least) are slightly different, can't remember the part number  I'll have to go and read it off but one is postfixed with an 'A' so whether its totally different or just an alternate revision we shall see. 


The part no is 315-5160

On El Caracho's post on J+ (http://www.jammaplus.co.uk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=24195&title=convert-outrun-motor-drive-board-for-space-harrier) he says that he has (had?) two SH drive boards one with 2x 315-5160 and one with a 315-5160 plus a 315-5160A...

The interesting thing is the A revision is in the spot where the plain old version is on an outrun board. What this all means I dunno.

Also I'm working on cleaning up the schematic but it's slow and painful, I think some of the other efforts on here will bizz ahead of me, but I'll still post when it's done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote karlcdoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 12:44pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

 
I figured we could use an image of the original as a bitmap to place the components in very similar places, then we can choose to route it as similarly as we can be bothered to.


Here is a scan of the underside of the motor pcb, it's the best quality this site and my scanner currently permit but I might be able to take a photo of better quality and upload elsewhere. I'm not that keen on scanning the top of the pcb if it means depopulating the entire board.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 12:59pm
A high res photo without flash is another good way to get the traces. Looks like two layer anyway so wouldnt be too hard to follow on the top.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 1:00pm
Excellent. That's probably enough - you can get the component positions by lining up the solder holes.
I don't suppose you could get X/Y dimensions so I can scale it correctly? (please).

Oh and my projectmaker page:
https://circuitmaker.com/User/Details/John-Bennett-11

It was dead easy to sign-up. Just needs an e-mail and password - no address, or personal details. 500MB download.

Will start a proper thread tonight with some instructions (or we just keep it in here?)
http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 1:07pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

Excellent. That's probably enough - you can get the component positions by lining up the solder holes.
I don't suppose you could get X/Y dimensions so I can scale it correctly? (please).

Oh and my projectmaker page:
https://circuitmaker.com/User/Details/John-Bennett-11

It was dead easy to sign-up. Just needs an e-mail and password - no address, or personal details. 500MB download.

Will start a proper thread tonight with some instructions (or we just keep it in here?)


I can look at laying the componants out and tracing it up later tonight if wanted,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 1:26pm
Originally posted by NaokiS NaokiS wrote:



I can look at laying the componants out and tracing it up later tonight if wanted,

Are you OK to have a go in Circuit Maker? I realise everyone has their preferred tool, but it does seem good (it's Altium), it has the team facility and I can go back and forth from the schematic as more bits are added or changed. The routing wasn't much different to Mentor (the * key is your friend for swapping layers).

I won't have a full schematic for a while, but I'll get a few ICs down and the PCB shape so there's something to start playing with :-).

Edit: I should add, that as there's no urgency, I was thinking it's more about establishing a 'team effort' structure to do interesting projects (with this being the first effort), so there's time to play with new tools.

Edited by John Bennett - 17 May 2018 at 1:27pm
http://www.philwip.com -sibling 'fix-off' (I’m losing by miles).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NaokiS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2018 at 1:30pm
Originally posted by John Bennett John Bennett wrote:

Originally posted by NaokiS NaokiS wrote:



I can look at laying the componants out and tracing it up later tonight if wanted,

Are you OK to have a go in Circuit Maker? I realise everyone has their preferred tool, but it does seem good (it's Altium), it has the team facility and I can go back and forth from the schematic as more bits are added or changed. The routing wasn't much different to Mentor (the * key is your friend for swapping layers).

I won't have a full schematic for a while, but I'll get a few ICs down and the PCB shape so there's something to start playing with :-).

Edit: I should add, that as there's no urgency, I was thinking it's more about establishing a 'team effort' structure to do interesting projects (with this being the first effort), so there's time to play with new tools.


Ill try it anyway. It would be a good learning excercise to start with. Failing that ill just default and convert the schems to eagle format

Im not trying to rush, im just bored woth nout to do lol
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