tonight’s tinkering - Greet scan line effect from mister Fpga on a vga .

[Retroman839]

VGA 31khz monitor with mister

Pleasantly surprised

Not one for vga monitors but the mister doing a great job with its scan line genarator .

 

[yoganuggy]

Same with mame/groovymame. Enable scanlines on 15k games on the naomi sanwa 31k monitor and it looks the exact same as on a dedicated 15k cga monitor.

Another one to try is to run a 24k ega mid res game on the 31k vga. It will have black bars top on bottom at first but if you stretch out the vertical height with the remote board it looks the same as a dedicated ega 24k monitor.

 

[Retroman839]

Same with mame/groovymame. Enable scanlines on 15k games on the naomi sanwa 31k monitor and it looks the exact same as on a dedicated 15k cga monitor.

Another one to try is to run a 24k ega mid res game on the 31k vga. It will have black bars top on bottom at first but if you stretch out the vertical height with the remote board it looks the same as a dedicated ega 24k monitor.

Nice one ..
I have a couple scan line genarators too.. which look good also on a 14” lcd I have. Really impressed with the mister crt filter best I have seen .

 

[John Bennett]

Does anything manage scanlines on 480i stuff? That's a proper odd one .

I need to read-up how they're even visible

 

[yoganuggy]

mame/groovymame doesn't seem to render 480i as 480i but rather as 480p (640x480 vga 31k)

Good case in point is your jbmame build for rave racer link. I've 2x WG D9200 CRT's in the twin driving cab that can do all the resolutions but the real PCB's are flickery 480i at 15k compared to the PC emulated 480p. The emulated version looks far better.


Maybe you see scanlines on the rear projector with 480i sources simply because it's such a big screen and 480i will have smaller scanlines than 240p sources?

 

[Retroman839]

D2900 ,,, great for mame

 

[John Bennett]

mame/groovymame doesn't seem to render 480i as 480i but rather as 480p (640x480 vga 31k)

Good case in point is your jbmame build for rave racer link. I've 2x WG D9200 CRT's in the twin driving cab that can do all the resolutions but the real PCB's are flickery 480i at 15k compared to the PC emulated 480p. The emulated version looks far better.


Maybe you see scanlines on the rear projector with 480i sources simply because it's such a big screen and 480i will have smaller scanlines than 240p sources?

Yeah, maybe it is the larger screen, something to ponder.
While I might have done my best to champion a rear projection revival, I can't see me getting far with an interlaced video reappraisal
It is nice for 3D out of a JAMMA cab or 15kHz monitor though, 240p is rather rough for 3D.

Yeah, MAME doesn't do interlaced. You could code something up to simulate it, but it'd be a bit strange on a modern monitor.

 

[Wahoobies]

Here's a raster.ini for mame that does a reasonable job of CRT phosphor floor/short persistence/shadow mask/scanlines.. I've tested on 4k & 1440, looks very nice on both

#
# DIRECT3D POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
shadow_mask_tile_mode     0
shadow_mask_alpha         0.25
shadow_mask_texture       shadow-mask.png
shadow_mask_x_count       12
shadow_mask_y_count       6
shadow_mask_usize         0.5
shadow_mask_vsize         0.5
shadow_mask_uoffset       0.0
shadow_mask_voffset       0.0
distortion                0.1
cubic_distortion          0.0
distort_corner            0.0
round_corner              0.05
smooth_border             0.05
reflection                0.0
vignetting                0.1
scanline_alpha            0.50
scanline_size             1.0
scanline_height           1.0
scanline_variation        1.0
scanline_bright_scale     2.0
scanline_bright_offset    0.0
scanline_jitter           0.0
defocus                   0.6,0.0
converge_x                0.0,0.0,0.0
converge_y                0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_x         0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_y         0.0,0.0,0.0
red_ratio                 1.00,0.00,0.00
grn_ratio                 -0.00,1.00,0.00
blu_ratio                 -0.00,0.00,1.10
saturation                1.20
offset                    -0.13,-0.13,-0.11
scale                     1.00,1.00,1.00
power                     1.00,1.00,1.00
floor                     0.025,0.025,0.025
phosphor_life             0.20,0.20,0.20
#
# NTSC POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
yiq_enable                0

#
# BLOOM POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
bloom_blend_mode          0
bloom_scale               0.25
bloom_overdrive           1.00,1.00,1.00
bloom_lvl0_weight         1.00
bloom_lvl1_weight         0.64
bloom_lvl2_weight         0.32
bloom_lvl3_weight         0.16
bloom_lvl4_weight         0.08
bloom_lvl5_weight         0.06
bloom_lvl6_weight         0.04
bloom_lvl7_weight         0.02
bloom_lvl8_weight         0.01

 

[Wahoobies]

VGA 31khz monitor with mister
View attachment 27711
Pleasantly surprised
View attachment 27712View attachment 27713
Not one for vga monitors but the mister doing a great job with its scan line genarator .

that does look bloody good

 

[Retroman839]

Nice one ..
Pop up a pic of you get a chance

 

[Wahoobies]

photographs of screen...overemphasizes the phos floor a bit

 

[Retroman839]

Is that on 4k ?
Look good for being on a hd tv!

 

[Wahoobies]

Yeah 4k LG G3.. Vector emulated games look insanely perfect on a high brightness OLED Now btw.. I also have a profile for vector if that excites anyone.
using win 11 with Auto-HDR enabled on a LG G3. Dark room, 4k screen with Battlezone.. first time since orig hardware to me that vectos emulated look right!

I've also got an Alienware QD-OLED with less total brighness, but it still looks great on vector games too with inky blacks and glowing beams

#
# CORE VECTOR OPTIONS
#
beam_width_min            1.00
beam_width_max            2.00
beam_intensity_weight     0.25
flicker                   0.05

#
# DIRECT3D POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
hlsl_oversampling         0
shadow_mask_tile_mode     0
shadow_mask_alpha         0.0
shadow_mask_texture       shadow-mask.png
shadow_mask_x_count       12
shadow_mask_y_count       6
shadow_mask_usize         0.5
shadow_mask_vsize         0.5
shadow_mask_uoffset       0.0
shadow_mask_voffset       0.0
distortion                0.1
cubic_distortion          0.0
distort_corner            0.0
round_corner              0.05
smooth_border             0.05
reflection                0.0
vignetting                0.1
scanline_alpha            0.0
defocus                   0.0,0.0
converge_x                0.0,0.0,0.0
converge_y                0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_x         0.0,0.0,0.0
radial_converge_y         0.0,0.0,0.0
red_ratio                 1.0,0.0,0.0
grn_ratio                 0.0,1.0,0.0
blu_ratio                 0.0,0.0,1.0
saturation                1.0
offset                    0.0,0.0,0.0
scale                     1.0,1.0,1.0
power                     1.0,1.0,1.0
floor                     0.0,0.0,0.0
phosphor_life             0.1,0.1,0.1

#
# NTSC POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
yiq_enable                0

#
# VECTOR POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
vector_beam_smooth        0.0
vector_length_scale       0.5
vector_length_ratio       0.5

#
# BLOOM POST-PROCESSING OPTIONS
#
bloom_blend_mode          0
bloom_scale               0.40
bloom_overdrive           1.00,1.00,1.00
bloom_lvl0_weight         1.00
bloom_lvl1_weight         0.48
bloom_lvl2_weight         0.32
bloom_lvl3_weight         0.24
bloom_lvl4_weight         0.16
bloom_lvl5_weight         0.24
bloom_lvl6_weight         0.32
bloom_lvl7_weight         0.48
bloom_lvl8_weight         0.64

 

[Wahoobies]

Adjust beam down if you prefer, you can set to 1.5 and it still looks great. Just depends on physical size of screen

 

[Wahoobies]

I find a lot of the shaders people over-emphasize the phosphor trails, defocus, color bleed, fringing etc.. as real CRT nerds here I expect you might agree, I prefer to have my emulators show what a near-perfect screen woud look like. I don't want virtual cigarette burns on the art and miscalibrated monitors emulated

 

[Retroman839]

🤣..
glad to hear that 4k oled is delivering a good vibe…. I’m not at the oled yet but nice to know it’s up to good stuff.
Geometry wars on HD very nice!

 

[Wahoobies]

🤣..
glad to hear that 4k oled is delivering a good vibe…. I’m not at the oled yet but nice to know it’s up to good stuff

Honestly it's a better upgrade than HD was! if you watch films in HDR that you saw in cinema pre-digital days, the brightness differences suddenly work again.

Remember Empire Strikes Back.. they cut from Han slicing the Tauntaun up in the dark to a scene of snowspeeders flying over drifts.. everyone in the cinema groaned from the brightness change.. you get to experience that again

There's still something amazingly visceral about a CRT to me, but I have to say emulation on OLED suddenly works properly, that brightness level and real blacks was missing for so long on LCD/VA panels. I think I'll have a hard time finding my holy grail (a battlezone full-size with periscope), but I get a lot of memories playing in a dark room on the big screen

 

[Retroman839]

I only got to go to Rotj
Days I cried when bothers went to cinema with dad ..
Empires
Indiana Jones
Tron.

Mum said it will be on tv next year ..
Waited about 15 years odd before bbc blasted it out at Christmas! Best Christmas ever!

 

[Retroman839]

But when I got to see rancore monster on screen it was worth it!
And salacious crumb.

Leía didn’t interest me then!

 

[kingtreelo]

i love my CRTs, not because of the scanlines that so many others like, but because of the sound they produce