Netbooting a Naomi2

[Outrun2]

Man, there's a lot of conflicting info on this subject on the various forums, which I guess is no surprise really as knowledge on the subject gradually grew over time. And IIRC any talk of the subject on forums was kinda frowned upon back when I was first getting into Naomi/Chihiro 15 or so years ago.. has it really been that long, I must be old??

Anyway, I generally use official software to run all games in my driving cabs, but I occasionally netboot the Chihiro type 3 in my Japanese OR2 using bbz149's pi based netbooter, so I do have some limited netboot experience.

My question here is around using the pi solution to netboot a Naomi2 (my initial D cab still uses a GD-ROM drive which won't last forever!).

1. I have two netdimms, both on firmware 2.06 which, if I understand correctly, can't be netbooted via the pi solution - I need at least firmware 3.03, 3.17, 4.01 or 4.02 to achieve this - is that correct? If so, I gather it is possible to netboot a 2.06 netdimm to 3.03/3.17/4.01/4.02 using a laptop and crossover cable via the transfergame.exe tool - is that correct?

I've seen it written that you have to send the update over a LAN/switch/regular network cable to update a 2.06 netdimm - not really possible with the location of my gear so I'm hoping this isn't true!

2. If firmware 2.06 to 3.03 or above via laptop/crossover cable is possible then I assume all I need is:

a. Transfergame.exe and the required firmware update BIN file (3.03 or 3.17 or 4.01 and 4.02 - the latter only if I want to load games with non-official CF cards which I don't)
b. Null pic specifically for Naomi1/2 - because I only have a Triforce/Chihiro null pic that won't work with Naomi.
c. Newish BIOS for Naomi2 like EPR-23605C - because I have old version BIOS in my Naomi2 boards that won't accept netbooting.

Can anyone confirm/comment on this? I don't have experience of updating firmware on these systems via netboot as I did all my Chihiro fimware updates years ago using a borrowed official update GD-ROM disc and most of my time these days is spent fiddling with 'reliable' old Model 3 hardware..!

 

[Ace`]

"If so, I gather it is possible to netboot a 2.06 netdimm to 3.03/3.17/4.01/4.02 using a laptop and crossover cable via the transfergame.exe tool - is that correct?"

no if that were possible then 2.06 wouldn't need updating because it could already netboot.

I offer an updating service if you need it.

 

[Sbdesign]

"If so, I gather it is possible to netboot a 2.06 netdimm to 3.03/3.17/4.01/4.02 using a laptop and crossover cable via the transfergame.exe tool - is that correct?"

no if that were possible then 2.06 wouldn't need updating because it could already netboot.

I offer an updating service if you need it.

So what is required ?
Interested to know

 

[Ace`]

A 3.17 firmware update gdrom disc or replacing the tsop flash on the dimm boards with one preflashed with 3.17. I can do both but it makes more sense to do use the update disc in this scenario.

 

[AndyGeezer]

4.xx added support for compact flash

3.xx is required for netbooting, most Type 1 triforce/chihiro had 3.03 firmware, and could net boot fine.

2.xx is legacy it was the introduction of networking, but didn't support net booting, introduction of simple ALL.NET VF4 type services.

1.xx is original dimm board, no networking functionality.

 

[channel27]

This suggest that you can netboot with 2.06: -
https://www.arcade-projects.com/threads/how-to-upgrade-your-netdimm-or-dimm-to-firmware-4-02.3296/

If you have NetDimm with 2.xx firmware:

Spoiler

• If this a NetDimm with 2.xx firmware, you can simply netboot to upgrade to 4.01 firmware with transfergame.exe. Once your NetDimm has rebooted to 4.01 firmware, you can now netboot to and upgrade to 4.02 firmware.
• For some reason, if you start with 2.xx firmware, you cannot netboot and upgrade to 3.17 with transfergame.exe. It fails for one reason or another. But the journey to 4.02 nirvana is simply achieved by netbooting the upgrade to 4.01 instead to get to 4.02.

NOTE: This has been successfully confirmed with 2.06 -> 4.01 -> 4.02. I have never heard of anyone starting with another version of 2.xx doing this successfully, but I am assuming this shall work without issue as 2.xx firmware introduced networking functionality to the Dimm/NetDimm. If someone with firmware 2.xx firmware other than 2.06 can confirm this, I can update these details.

And someone in the comments wrote: -

I have solved updating net dimm 2.06!
Must use a router unmanaged switch didn't work unless a router was also connected.
"Must open command prompt as admin"
Type CD <path-of-folder-containing-transfergame+update.bin>
Type TransferGame.exe <naomisIP> <filename.bin> -f
Hope that helps anyone who is stuck!!

...not tried it myself though

 

[AndyGeezer]

Actually I think I updated 2.6 via net boot too come to think of it. 3.17 added ALL.NET/VF.NET functionality for VF4 Final Tuned. But so long since I did all the net boot discovery stuff, and finding the byte in the PIC chip to allow net boot flag - TBH it's all thanks to Sega/WCCF.

But try it, you'll need a net boot compatible PIC though if you use transfergame.exe, but I think there linux scripts that can do net booting without a chip present.

 

[Ace`]

Worth a try but I was always under the impression you needed 3.03 or higher to netboot. Lots of false infomation out there, someone said you needed the original revision naomi with sanace fan to play hotd2 or you'd get graphics errors. This was thought to be true for years until quite recently and was found to be BS.

 

[AndyGeezer]

Worth a try but I was always under the impression you needed 3.03 or higher to netboot. Lots of false infomation out there, someone said you needed the original revision naomi with sanace fan to play hotd2 or you'd get graphics errors. This was thought to be true for years until quite recently and was found to be BS.

Actually HOTD2 is true, if you run it on a Naomi CRX the graphics are messed up, the holly chip is different on later Naomi - CRX naomi is easy to spot the mainboard is smaller.

 

[Ace`]

 

[AndyGeezer]

View attachment 45139

Get the original HOTD2 cart, original HOTD2 bios and try it.. Net booting image was patched to work.

 

[Ace`]

I have, on multiple motherboard revisions and so did mame guru, no issues.

 

[Fantazia2]

Wasnt the issue found to be down to needing the correct BIOS?
I'm sure its been patched/modified to enable netboot and works ok as well.

 

[Bods]

Are you getting mixed up with the Non San Ace Fan boards that are same size as those, the later ones are much smaller without the connectors for Naomi Multi systems

 

[Vamino]

I have an Official CF kit which comes with a Chip + Disc titled 'Firm Update for CF-Box'. Pretty sure that allows you to update the FW on the Netdimm to ver 4.01. Think I updated the Naomi 2 in my old IDv2, can't remember though as it's been so long.

I can post it to you if you like mate?
Then once you've used it just post it back.

 

[Vamino]

I also have a Dataman 48 pin Rom burner so can hopefully burn a couple of Bios chips if needed.
Think I have some old F355 Bios chips that can be erased and reprogrammed if those are the correct ones.

No idea what options to choose, but can fumble along and give it a go.

Obviously don't want anything in return, as you've done a lot for the community Gary.

 

[Vamino]

 

[Outrun2]

Thanks for all the replies - it's been active in this thread, sorry for my delayed reply!

"If so, I gather it is possible to netboot a 2.06 netdimm to 3.03/3.17/4.01/4.02 using a laptop and crossover cable via the transfergame.exe tool - is that correct?"

no if that were possible then 2.06 wouldn't need updating because it could already netboot.

I offer an updating service if you need it.

Hehe yeah, that did cross my mind as being pretty obvious and with all the conflicting info I'd read, felt I'd post here to try and get some 2025 clarity Not sure I'm 100% clearer, but maybe the takeaway is that it is possible to update from 2.06 to 3.17 and greater, but it's not as easy as it might be for newer, post 3.03 versions (ref requiring a router unmanaged switch).

Update service sounds interesting, thanks for the offer. Looks like you're too far away for me to deliver in person and it looks like I might be ok now thanks to Ian. This is providing the 4.01 disc updates a 2.06 netdimm?

I have an Official CF kit which comes with a Chip + Disc titled 'Firm Update for CF-Box'. Pretty sure that allows you to update the FW on the Netdimm to ver 4.01. Think I updated the Naomi 2 in my old IDv2, can't remember though as it's been so long.

I can post it to you if you like mate?
Then once you've used it just post it back.

That's a generous offer mate, thank you. I updated my Chihiros with a disc and it was straightforward - actually it was Andy who loaned me the disc when I upgraded to his SSD solution in my OR2 twin (thanks again Andy, still works flawlessly BTW).

I've found a chip labelled 'netboot pic' that I got ages ago but it never worked with the Chihiro. Maybe that is the Naomi version as I never got around to looking to try it on that system, probably due to not having the required firmware and all the faff it entailed.. and other projects being higher up the list! Hopefully it is the correct pic.

That would just leave me needing the latest BIOS if I can update the netdimms here via disc. Looks like Andy does them so happy to put some money his way if he has them in stock - would save you the trouble of converting one of your F355 BIOS chips

Thanks again to everyone for the input..

 

[Vamino]

Thanks for all the replies - it's been active in this thread, sorry for my delayed reply!


Hehe yeah, that did cross my mind as being pretty obvious and with all the conflicting info I'd read, felt I'd post here to try and get some 2025 clarity Not sure I'm 100% clearer, but maybe the takeaway is that it is possible to update from 2.06 to 3.17 and greater, but it's not as easy as it might be for newer, post 3.03 versions (ref requiring a router unmanaged switch).

Update service sounds interesting, thanks for the offer. Looks like you're too far away for me to deliver in person and it looks like I might be ok now thanks to Ian. This is providing the 4.01 disc updates a 2.06 netdimm?


That's a generous offer mate, thank you. I updated my Chihiros with a disc and it was straightforward - actually it was Andy who loaned me the disc when I upgraded to his SSD solution in my OR2 twin (thanks again Andy, still works flawlessly BTW).

I've found a chip labelled 'netboot pic' that I got ages ago but it never worked with the Chihiro. Maybe that is the Naomi version as I never got around to looking to try it on that system, probably due to not having the required firmware and all the faff it entailed.. and other projects being higher up the list! Hopefully it is the correct pic.

That would just leave me needing the latest BIOS if I can update the netdimms here via disc. Looks like Andy does them so happy to put some money his way if he has them in stock - would save you the trouble of converting one of your F355 BIOS chips

Thanks again to everyone for the input..

I've just had a look through a box of ROMS, I remember Mike gave me some ROMs that are stored in a small wooden case, but I'm stumped where they are.

Not sure if all of these are compatible, but 2 look to be suitable for Naomi.



I actually met up with Andy last week, I bought a couple of bits from him and played on his Multi driver. Man, you wanna see what Andy has up his sleeve! I hope it sees the light of day soon.

 

[Vamino]

The FW on the NetDimm in my old IDv2 cab was pretty old and didn't run CF, so hopefully the disc/pic and ROM's are all you need.

I'll see if I have any luck burning the ROM's on my day off later in the week. I bought the burner ages ago and I've not even burned anything on it yet! I built an XP PC with serial ports specifically to use with the Dataman burner, and also to dump some mini DV cassettes via Firewire which worked a treat.