Rastan to Rastan Saga

[ben76]

Hi guys,
How difficult is it to change an original Rastan pcb into the Jap English Rastan Saga (it has intro scenes etc) If its just a case of swapping a couple of chips over can anyone do me any? Also if its desoldering some chips would I be better putting sockets in so it can be either or is it not possible? If thats a good idea anyone got any sockets

Oh I'm fine with soldering btw

TIA
- Ben

 

[Guests]

best place to start is check the mame source code there might be some notes on teh hardware in there it might just be a romswap

 

[ben76]

This what you mean?
MAMEInfo:

ROM REGION:
b04-35.19 00010000 cpu1 00000000
b04-37.07 00010000 cpu1 00000001
b04-45.20 00010000 cpu1 00020000
b04-44.08 00010000 cpu1 00020001
b04-42.21 00010000 cpu1 00040000
b04-41-1.09 00010000 cpu1 00040001
b04-19.49 00010000 cpu2 00000000
b04-01.40 00020000 gfx1 00000000
b04-03.39 00020000 gfx1 00020000
b04-02.67 00020000 gfx1 00040000
b04-04.66 00020000 gfx1 00060000
b04-05.15 00020000 gfx2 00000000
b04-07.14 00020000 gfx2 00020000
b04-06.28 00020000 gfx2 00040000
b04-08.27 00020000 gfx2 00060000
b04-20.76 00010000 snd1 00000000

ORIGINAL:
Rastan (World)

Jap rev1
ROM REGION:
b04-14.19 00010000 cpu1 00000000
b04-13.7 00010000 cpu1 00000001
b04-16-1.20 00010000 cpu1 00020000
b04-15-1.8 00010000 cpu1 00020001
b04-18-1.21 00010000 cpu1 00040000
b04-17-1.9 00010000 cpu1 00040001
b04-19.49 00010000 cpu2 00000000
b04-01.40 00020000 gfx1 00000000
b04-03.39 00020000 gfx1 00020000
b04-02.67 00020000 gfx1 00040000
b04-04.66 00020000 gfx1 00060000
b04-05.15 00020000 gfx2 00000000
b04-07.14 00020000 gfx2 00020000
b04-06.28 00020000 gfx2 00040000
b04-08.27 00020000 gfx2 00060000
b04-20.76 00010000 snd1 00000000

 

[Guests]

no you need to look at the mame driver for that hardware and see if theres any notes on the differences.

 

[Alpha1]

Pretty sure you can romswap 'em.

 

[ben76]

no you need to look at the mame driver for that hardware and see if theres any notes on the differences.

This then?
http://mamedev.org/source/src/mame/drivers/rastan.c.html
Part way down it says

- These 2 games are 100% the same, only region differs !

So I'd guess I can?
- Ben

 

[paulcan69]

ok cool see my pm

 

[paulcan69]

Wow I was up late last night ^^ didn't even realise that was the time (Look at my last post time

)

I never seem to sleep properly....

Anyway you could be in luck fella, if your board is like the following picture....

I had a look at this last night to compare the crc's of Rastan and Rastan Saga, to me (don't go by just my word) it looked like 7 roms were different.

Looking at the pic on crazy kong (below) then all the chips are eproms and in sockets, please confirm is this the case with yours?

Also if 7 roms need to be changed then in that pic 8 eproms are on that board and in sockets??

(Maybe one is the same??)

Anyhoo here's the pic anyone else got light to throw on this, anyone done this region change?

Thanks,

 

[ben76]

This is my pcb...
How it arrived in a case not a bad idea

Then the pcb inside lots of socketed goodness there!

- Ben

 

[ben76]

Looks identical to the pic you posted Pauly mate
- Ben

 

[paulcan69]

Dude I can't quite tell but are the 8 roms (with the white square stickers on them) in sockets already?

 

[ben76]

Dude I can't quite tell but are the 8 roms (with the white square stickers on them) in sockets already?

Yes they are mate. Also the block of 8 taito ones are too
- Ben

 

[paulcan69]

Ok sweet, I can do that for you then.

It's the ones with the white/silver stickers which hold the version, the Taito mask roms are the same for both versions.

What do you want to do now? Just blow over the top of those roms, or get some new/other ones?

(They do have a glass window under the white/silver stickers yeah?)

Get the exact no.'s from one of those chips, I can have a look at home but I'm sure I'm running out of most things now.

010's and 020's I have a few (due to r-types) but I think they will be 512's or something smaller?

Get me the no's and confirm that they have a glass window in them, if you want to re-use them.

Maybe "IC china" on ebay to buy some used ones get say 10 incase of errors in some of them.

Post whatever to me and I shall do it.

MAKE SURE YOU TAKES LOTS OF PHOTO'S OF WHERE THEY ALL GO AND WHATS CURRENTLY WRITEN ON THE LABELS!! *Very Important!!*

ta!

 

[Guests]

and dump them before you wipe them if you are reusing the roms in case its a different version/revision or in case it doesn't work.

 

[paulcan69]

and dump them before you wipe them if you are reusing the roms in case its a different version/revision or in case it doesn't work.

Good call will do bud, I shall check the old ones vs mame to make sure the interweb has them already!

 

[ben76]

Ok had a looky and....
The full brand name etc is Toshiba TMM275120-20
So lets see if I get this correct they're 275120 and the speed is 20?
They all have B04 on them then a number sort of like this...
____ ____ ___
! ! ! ! ! !
! 2 ! ! 2 ! ! 2 !
! 4 ! ! 2 ! ! 1 !
!___! !___ ! !__ !

____ ____ ___
! ! ! ! ! !
! 2 ! ! 2 ! ! 1 !
! 5 ! ! 3 ! ! 4 !
!___! !___ ! !__ !

____
! !
! 1 !
! 9 !
!___!

____
! !
! 2 !
! 0 !
!___ !

Thats the labeled ones obviously there's more on the board.
Couple of qu's how much are they to buy and if expensive how would I send them to you if these ones get wiped (think they've got a window didn't remove the stickers but there a circle imprint under them) wrapped in bubble wrap or don't they need to be on some sponge stuff?
Cheers

- Ben

 

[paulcan69]

Well £10-£15 here's an example.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10pcs-M27C512-12F1-IC-DIP-512K-EPROM-New-28pin-/310368513493?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item484367add5

Yes -20 is the speed

I think those above are -12 (which again "I think" is ok as it's faster ...is that right someone?)

Yes the circle under the sticker will be the eprom's window so they can be blanked.

To post them yes you need something like a sponge, be carefull some things will cause static so seek advice on here about that and what is the best way to send them if you haven't got the original tubes which roms come in.

But if you buy from Hong Kong they will send them in the correct tubes which protect the roms legs.

Let me know your plans when you are ready so I know if I need to do something.

No charge for me doing it for you so....postage that's it.

If you buy more roms (so you have jap/eng) then £10-£15 + postage.

Ta

Paulyous.

 

[ben76]

So if buy those ones ^^^^ send them you you can put the code on and I just put them on my pcb?
If thats it I'm loving it as McD's say

Now just to find £10

Hopefully my redundancy will come through next week!
- Ben

 

[trm]

I'd be tempted just to send the current ROMs, have Paul dump & romident (be sure to use a recent copy of the Mame exe as the hashes for romident are stored in the exe) and then blow the code onto them if they turn out to be previously dumped which is most likely. Saves you waiting for the overseas delivery.

The -12 are indeed faster than the -20. As technology improved access speeds improved by dropping in length, in this example from 200 nanoseconds (nS - a billionth of a second) down to 120. And to keep things simple the manufacturers just drop the last zero. So a -10 is twice as fast as a -20 which is faster than a -50 and so on.

The time value is the access time which is basically how fast the EPROM can lookup the address requested and gate the value on the data output pins. So if you use a faster part the data is just ready sooner which isn't a problem. But if you use a slower part then the circuit might try to read the data before it's present leading to all sorts of weirdness.

tim

 

[trm]

Just for info, here is a pretty good explanation of some of the details about EPROMS http://www.arlabs.com/help.htm